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After Dark: Are You SERIOUS???


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#41 zuckerman

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Posted 27 March 2010 - 11:02 PM

QUOTE
Come on guys, you're not fourteen and neither are most of your customers, expect more than the lowest common denominator.


i also used "lowest common denominator" in a conversation i had about this pack.

QUOTE (kkffoo @ Mar 27 2010, 03:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Is it just me finding this whole episode incredibly depressing?


nope. i'm with ya.

I'm all for nude skins and steamy animations. But this is just porn. Morphable penis'? Looping BJs? Who the hell here is really gonna use that -- for something other than porn or to make some fleeting joke to prove me wrong? I'm all for simulated R-rated sex scenes but seriously.... a morphable penis?!

Hey, I'm all about no censorship so balls away! Didn't mean to get all school marmy on ya. I just wish this didn't feel so... sleazy. And I just wonder when we're gonna see something substantial that we've all really asked for -- Facemaker, BodyShaper, Action Pack, Children, etc.

And if we're going "Adult" O.K. tits and ass is good, but how about cigarettes?



#42 Chris Ollis

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Posted 27 March 2010 - 11:04 PM

QUOTE (supermep @ Mar 27 2010, 10:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Chris... any chance of getting two puppets to hold hands and walk side by side? There is a lot of call for this animation.

Cheers!


Simple answer is no.
Something like that would require a hell of a lot of IK calculation and walk control. It wouldn't be an animation as much as a lot of code tieing the hands to each other during the walk.

The alternative is to have a very large chunk of mutual animation, but that would not work with walk paths or any other improvised motion, look ats etc etc etc.


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#43 iceaxe

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Posted 27 March 2010 - 11:27 PM

QUOTE (kkffoo @ Mar 27 2010, 03:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Is it just me finding this whole episode incredibly depressing?



It is depressing. It is sad.

Ironically, it is far from mature though.



#44 supermep

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 01:17 AM

Hmmm. I know The Movies can do it. I'm gonna look into the code of that and see how they pulled it off.


I think everyone should keep in mind that this "after dark" pack is just a test run. I'm sure (as Chris has stated) they are just sticking their foot into the water to see what kind of demand there is and for what sort of animations/costumes etc etc.

So let's all just take a deep breath and relax. If you don't want to use the pack... don't purchase it. And if you haven't noticed yet but when you upload a movie there is now a "mature content" button. So I think there is a way you can filter out all the movies that have checked that button while uploading.

Obviously not everyone will be conscientious enough to check that button... but we can only hope.


wink.gif

Cheers,

#45 mcornetto

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 01:37 AM

I don't think there is any problems with the pack. So, it's a porn pack, but there is an audience for that sort of thing and it will probably bring in some much needed revenue. With a real revenue stream Moviestorm will be able to hire people that can concentrate on giving us some less profitable content. It isn't like MS hasn't been giving us lots of free content lately, is it? So if they want to go off on this little trip and it brings them some money and that benefits us in the long run then who does that hurt? I doubt very much they plan on exclusively providing sex pack so we are sure to see some interesting and perhaps less mainstream sort of packs in the future. Right now I, for one, am happy to have the nude skins - so I got a couple of animations I'll never use (even though they are kind of fun to play with). Rather than depressing, I find the new development exciting because rather than narrowing the future content prospects, it opens them to all kinds of things.

#46 Overman

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 02:52 AM

I'll pipe in here and say I'm glad the pack was released. The skins, in particular, are of really great quality.

There are some legitimate criticisms to be made of the content in the After Dark pack - I'd much prefer something of a Zalman King flavor than Seymour Butts, personally... some indication of feminine influence on the animation choices is going to be really important to me re: the usability of future extensions of this content. I also hope some care will be taken to fill in more foreplay / sensuality types of interaction, and to explore beyond heterosexuality, too.

But as I'd already suspected, this was a testing of the waters, and you don't invest the kind of time required for complex couples interaction when you're just doing a test. Just as one can look at all the animations and state the commonality is male chauvinism, one can just as easily see another common thread which was more likely the deliberate one: they're all fairly simple / easy animations to create. I realize that understanding of this requires a base of knowledge in how these animations work under the hood, but if you don't have that then take Chris' word for it.

Some are really getting hung up on the presence of the morphing male member. It is a distinctly United States mindset that immediately assumes no possible application for that outside of hardcore porn. And why not think so? It's kind of been the standard here since before any of us were born. But setting aside differences in cultural interpretation... my take is this. If you're going to do nudity, then you do nudity not Ken dolls. And if you're going to do a male member, then you do it with some functionality. If they'd left out the morph, you'd have people complaining about that.

Will it get used for juvenile purposes and porn? Sure, by those whose understanding of sexuality IS actually summarized as "Start > Loop > Stop". So what? Sims porn exists; did it overrun the Sims movie-making world? Second Life porn tools exist, in spades. Is that inhibiting the creativity of filmmakers in Second Life, or hindering them getting their work seen / taken seriously, or getting even a modicum of airtime at any machinima venues of significance? The truth is the same in those worlds as it is / will be in Moviestorm: if you don't want to use it in your movies, then don't get/use the pack. And if you don't want to watch movies with that content, then don't. Porn's not going to "take over" for one simple reason: most people don't want to watch it.

If you're upset because you think this is a sign that Moviestorm isn't listening to their users, then I suggest you check your premises. If you're just concerned that Moviestorm has invested a ton of time and effort into this content pack instead of whichever one you wanted more... well, they didn't. If examination of the pack didn't make that abundantly clear, Chris did earlier in this thread.

If you're aggravated that you don't have every model or animation you need to make your movie, then let me just say: Welcome to machinima, nice to meet you. Step 1: Make your decision - Either...
A] write within the limitations of the platform,
B] compromise your existing screenplay to fit the platform limitations,
C] take the time to learn to modify the platform to reduce those limitations, or
D] get creative with your shot selection, use of sound, compositing, and other post production.

I personally prefer a combination of C+D, with B as a last resort if a problem is particularly vexing. But any of these choices is legitimate based on your skills, available time, and willingness to think outside of the box. Sitting around whining and complaining for someone else to eliminate your need for any compromise / change in thinking is, you'll note, conspicuously absent from the list, because I don't think it's a mindset that leads to movies being made.

I'll add to this by echoing the sentiments I voiced at IceAxe's blog: I think it's terribly hasty to take the release of this pack as some kind of larger expression of where the entire Moviestorm product is heading. There is simply no evidence of that. There are a lot of balls in the air at Moviestorm Inc., as is apparent when you follow their development blog. It's easy (and erroneous) to infer from that a lack of direction. It's called multitasking, and it's how every serious software developer works. The big difference is the startling degree of transparency Moviestorm has offered us from day one; that's what is atypical.

Interesting and sad that said transparency seems to breed in some a sense of entitlement more than gratitude. Sometimes we respond to that partial transparency as if it IS full transparency, and the puzzle over decisions that "don't make sense," forgetting that we actually aren't privy to everything. And sometimes we respond to that partial transparency with nothing but calls for full disclosure, as if this is some government agency under obligations of a Freedom of Information Act. I sincerely hope we don't cause Moviestorm to second guess the decision to have the degree of transparency they've extended.

This pack has some people who like it, and some people who don't, and for some it feeds an already disgruntled disposition toward Moviestorm. This pack doesn't please everyone. And it isn't at the top of everyone's private "Top Priority" lists (as variant as the very quantity of users).

And in those regards, this pack is exactly like every other content pack released for Moviestorm since Core.
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#47 zuckerman

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 06:22 AM

Really, Phil? C'mon. This post comes off as just a tad condescending and a bit hypocritical. You yourself have gotten passionately angry regarding some of the recent content to come out not to mention the general direction MS has appeared to have taken.

This isn't just about the Porn Pack -- you must know that. Frankly, I'm surprised at the entire tone of this post. If the whole is the sum of its parts then looping BJs, morphable genitalia, and doggystyle-o-mations equal Porn Pack -- any Joe off the street would agree. Now what is wrong with porn, you might ask? Nothing! It's mother's milk to me and probably most of you! However, in the context of MS, porn seems very odd -- especially at this phase. But more importantly, in the context of the direction MS is taking it is disheartening and troubling. But why, you say? Because it appears that MS is pandering to -- as Kkffoo said -- "the lowest common denominator". I keep hearing about all these awesome things that are coming down the pipeline-- stuff that the majority of users have been clamoring for -- and yet all I keep seeing is Photostorm, The Fun Pack, Porn, and Cheese Farting Contests. Phil, you were inconsolable over the release of Photostorm! OK, I'm being cute... but you were really pissed. When you spoke out against Photostorm did you yourself forget to check your premises? Perhaps you we're being a tad too hasty? Maybe you we're simply being an overly entitled, ungrateful little ninny. In short, do you feel that you should have just shut your mouth and say "Thank You Moviestorm, may I have another?" I don't think you do. Perhaps I'm wrong. I thought your various responses to Photostorm were sound and just. I think your voice is important to the future of MS.

As for the "transparency" stuff I believe that is exactly what is at the core of all this hoopla. I have been given the impression, sometimes promises, time and time again that certain updates, packs, and features would be coming to MS. I have stuck around mostly in part to these impressions and promises -- as have many of the users here. However the recent releases of content, all mentioned in the above paragraph, go in a direction I don't like and, more importantly, much different then MS has suggested to all of us.

Now, am I entitled to have MS the way I want it or for the MS folks to tell me everything about MS whenever the hell I want? Of course not! I'm just a dude -- who really just does love this program. But I have been one helluva loyal user and if the MS folks are good enough to give us a forum to voice our concerns, hopes, and dreams then I'm gonna use that forum and sometimes say things like:

DUDES! A PORN PACK!!!!! REALLY!!!? C'MON?! Maybe you could actually release content that there has been countless threads and polls about for years... in between these content releases aimed at ur recent spurt of Facebook "users." Speaking of your FB users do they even exist? 'cause I kinda hate them.

Anyway, I'm personally not disgruntled. I'm just freaked out a little. And I'm still pissed about Photostorm.
I love Moviestorm. I wanna be on Charlie Rose one day and say "Moviestorm gave me the start I needed" and then click my tongue, point my finger, and wink at the camera.

Look, when I think about it, if this pack came after a really great pack or, dare I say, the Facemaker, I think a lot of the angry folks would have felt much differently. Honestly, I would have just laughed my ass off and said, "YES!!!! A Porn Pack! These guys are awesome and silly!"

Maybe it's just... bad timing.

#48 iceaxe

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 10:19 AM

QUOTE (supermep @ Mar 28 2010, 01:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
they are just sticking their foot into the water to see what kind of demand there is and for what sort of animations/costumes etc etc.


Would that be a morphable foot they're sticking in, I wonder. rolleyes.gif



#49 Chris Ollis

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 10:52 AM

QUOTE (iceaxe @ Mar 28 2010, 10:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Would that be a morphable foot they're sticking in, I wonder. rolleyes.gif


Just to shut you people up.... wink.gif the morph tests we have done on getting the ruder body parts moving have obviously been a success, which means I can start creating morphable fat versions of all characters once I've got my plate clear.

Now, which of ye of little faith wants to keep complaining?
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#50 Nahton

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 12:26 PM

I just wanted to make everyone aware that this topic will be discussed on the Roger and Ken Show today on TMOA Radio.

TMOA Radio

#51 celestina

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 12:28 PM

After I cleaned up the tea and dried my clothes....lol! I was curious, so I downloaded this pack. The animations here are hard-core, but the models are so beautifully designed... great job! I am not offended... although it would be great to balance it up a bit. More bedroom, female interactions etc... so I will be looking out for these in the future... although there are some other romantic interactions we can use...

Also, and to open it up... I notice some of the animations don't work with clothes on... one of the 'doggy' positions seems to work well as a 'happy to see you after such a long time' situation. For example, an airport scene - the lady is so happy to see her partner that she jumps up with her legs around his waist and hugs him but this doesn't work for dressed characters at the moment.

Yes, it's exciting about opening up the possibilities of morphing... a pregnant lady perhaps too? (although some outfits might not work - as with the bed covers, I am sure some would). Using the computer animation would be really good too... wink.gif

I must admit... I really like the idea of a 'mature' section... smile.gif

This link will take you there: Celestina's Texture Collections ... COUNTRY COLLECTION Ready Now!

#52 ubernewbie

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 01:19 PM

Does this mean we can Jamacians now.
Do you want some sauce, so you can EAT ME!

#53 iceaxe

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 02:45 PM

QUOTE (Chris Ollis @ Mar 28 2010, 10:52 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Just to shut you people up.... wink.gif the morph tests we have done on getting the ruder body parts moving have obviously been a success, which means I can start creating morphable fat versions of all characters once I've got my plate clear.

Now, which of ye of little faith wants to keep complaining?


Well that it good news. But why start with genitalia?

#54 Chris Ollis

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 02:49 PM

QUOTE (iceaxe @ Mar 28 2010, 02:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Well that it good news. But why start with genitalia?


Doesn't everything? biggrin.gif
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#55 iceaxe

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 02:55 PM

QUOTE (Chris Ollis @ Mar 28 2010, 02:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Doesn't everything? biggrin.gif


Very droll Chris! smile.gif

I've just had a look at the iClone packs and I don't see anything there that features a scalable cock, so obviously you've got a competitive advantage over iClone there.

By "you", I mean Moviestorm of course. I'm quite sure you already had fully morphable genitals before all this kicked off Chris! smile.gif

#56 Cnhnet

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 03:19 PM

I agree with mrkip2001.

#57 ubernewbie

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 03:35 PM

Is this the first MS porn demo?

http://www.tmundergr...storm-Porn-Demo
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#58 lucindamc123

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 03:47 PM

Actually I haven't seen this much posting on these forums in weeks so maybe everyone needed a shock to get talking again. And remember next week is April Fool's Day.

Chris, I figured you were experimenting with morphing bodies. That is great.

Maybe being older has advantages as it didn't shock me at all. Actually my husband loved the animations. LOL. I won't really use them, well I wouldn't show the lower body if I used them except if someone can mod me a furry skin and tail to go with the Werewolf head and that is only so I can make some joke movies for my Sci Fi Fantasy friends who are into furry.

#59 kv

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 03:47 PM

I was a little stumped when I noticed the sudden release of this pack, and I admit I have not got it yet, but I do plan to get it as it could be useful in the right hands. With the continuing development on morphs it is quite exciting, particularly since Chris has just said about finally getting morhpable fat people.

I do not object to this pack at all, in fact its good of moviestorm to look at some of the more mature users, hopefully at some point we will see more violent animations in the future to.

The way I see it is for those who object to this release, simple dont buy it rolleyes.gif

#60 ubernewbie

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 03:52 PM

QUOTE (kv @ Mar 28 2010, 03:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I was a little stumped when I noticed the sudden release ..., and I admit I have not got it yet, but I do plan to get it as it could be useful in the right hands. ... particularly since Chris has just said about finally getting morhpable fat people.


That's what she said.
Do you want some sauce, so you can EAT ME!


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