78 replies to this topic

[kkffoo]

That sounds like a great idea Chris.

I know many people are aware that credit issues have been pretty destructive in some communities, and a EULA to fall back on would be a reassuring safety net.

[andy_price]

I'm tempted to try and get an official stance on this, something along the lines of unless otherwise stated all user generated Moviestorm mods, commercial or free are royalty free for movie making use, but if possible credit should be given either in the movie description or credits.
Redistribution without the creators consent is forbidden.

That is exactly what I am trying to say, you are better with words than I

[primaveranz]

And a lot of users don't frequent these forums.

Why would they not ?

[Moviestorm]

License terms for mods isn't something that Moviestorm is prepared to - or should be - involved in. However, we'd suggest the following general approach.

- It's good practice to credit modders, particularly those who contribute significant mods. However, sometimes this isn't practical, for example, if it would make the list of credits too long for the movie. And sometimes, people forget who created a mod, or forget they've used a particular mod, especially if it's only on-screen briefly. So if your mod is used and not credited, be reasonable about it.

- If there are no specific licensing terms, assume that people will feel free to use your mod in commercial projects, especially if they've paid for it.

- If you specifically don't want your mod used in commercial projects, say so before the user downloads it.

- If your mod does turn up in a commercial project, it's usually best to assume it's an honest mistake and the director didn't know, had forgotten, or didn't realize your mod was actually in there. Again, be reasonable about it: most "commercial" machinima projects earn a few hundred bucks at most, and you're not being swindled out of thousands of dollars in royalties, even if your mod is center stage.

- Obviously if someone is repackaging your mod and reselling it under their own name, that's a completely different matter to using mods in commercial movie projects. However, there's certainly a grey area when it comes to mods of mods, and that usually needs to be settled on a case by case basis.

It's important to keep this issue in proportion, though. Very few people make commercial machinima. It's not something most modders will ever have to worry about.

[kkffoo]

Any chance we can have this as a sticky somewhere?

[Moviestorm]

Any chance we can have this as a sticky somewhere?

Done

[Moviestorm]

I posted a long piece about credits on the Moviestorm blog. I'll be interested to read your responses.

- Matt

[Harb40]

As a general rule, in my Passion Competitions, I require that credit be given where credit is due. With that said, I also post that the credit does not have to be in the film itself as long as it is on the movie page with the film. By doing that, if someone has a 5 minute film, they don't need 1.5 minutes of credit if they used 20 different mods (sets, costumes, make-up, props, etc).

What I think is that if you use a particular item (mod) as a staple of the film, then it should go into the film credit. What I mean by this is, say I use Shirley's Victorian Props throughout the whole movie, then I would credit her in the film itself. If I just used PapaG's recolored guitar in one 10 second scene, I would probably not put that in the film but would credit him on the film page as a modder.

Does this make sense?

[gitsch]

Re :License terms for mods isn't something that Moviestorm is prepared to - or should be - involved in.

IMHO

MS has to get involved to be commercially viable itself. MS is no longer free and if you want revenue, there better be a hope of recovery for users. If this is all just a hobby for you, ignore me and play on

It's not now powerful or versitile enough on its own for commercial use. No stairs, sliders, platforms amd a bunch of other neat stuff. And the current Mod situation is out of control. All the mods show up in the general prop area and it's almost impossible to remember what came from who if you want to concentrate on just making a movie. THat doesn't matter if I'm just doing a fun clip for this board.

But. Copyright issue coverage from individual modders is not solid. If commercial producers are asked to certify as in the Amazon Studios contests that all is good, we need better support in order to participate.

I've been exploring MS to see if it were appropriate for Independant Film and Commercial Production, and right now it falls short on the clearance end, as a whole. And that kills the whole opportunity. And my need to pay for Moviestorm.

MS should vet sets of mods and offer "cleared mod" packs under it's security. For a fee.
Or replicate and issue their own similar mods. The resulting mix up would simply be credited as part of the "Animated in Moviestorm. "

[lucindamc123]

I have made commercial shorts with Moviestorm and been paid for them and I plan to use Moviestorm for Vautrin which is a commercial movie. With being able now to make our own animated props and characters, Moviestorm is now unlimited.

[lucindamc123]

Your blog would not allow me to comment so I will post my response here:

I still think mods and props should be credited since they are original artwork, not just something downloaded from 3d warehouse and converted for use in Moviestorm. Even when you get sound effects from places like Freesound.org, you have to credit the creators of those sound effects. The same is true of royalty free photographs used.

[kkffoo]

How much do people earn for commercial Machinima.
See original article

PC Gamer: How are you doing now? Does your machinima work bring in enough to live on, or are you doing other stuff too?

Ross Scott: My income definitely varies. I can’t say what I earn for contractual reasons, but I will say if you work flipping burgers or bagging groceries, you are very competitive with what I earn. It’s currently my primary source of income, but I do some other oddjobs as well. While I suppose my future is uncertain, I’m very frugal and I can eat and pay rent and I’m not in debt.

[luxaeternam]

I'd better hang on to my day job, then!

[iceaxe]

At the risk of dragging this thread down a non-related rat-hole...

I think to go full time making machinima with MS (or any other tool) sounds like a very risky business; you'd have to be extraordinarily good in order to make a living from it.

However, if you ran a small creative agency, perhaps doing presentation production for corporates then machinima could be a valuable string to your bow.

[lucindamc123]

You are not going to make much with using computer games to make movies because of course they are the property of the company who creates these games. That is different than making movies with programs like Iclone and Moviestorm and also learning 3d animation and modeling with programs like 3ds Max. I was very happy with the money I made this summer and my rate is not that high either. But I work very quickly and have a lot of experience so time wise, I did quite well. Whether the commercial movies I am making will make much, I don't know. Depends upon the distributor and of course all the actors, modders, musicians get a percentage of the profits which I split 50/50 with the writer of the script. I didn't even get into this with the idea of making money but it just came along and people offered me work. I just want my movies to get out there and be seen and to participate in this artistic medium. I have always been that way even when I was doing silk painting and batik and showing in shows all over the country. And I don't really need the money. I would like to get some profit from it to do things like buy the pro version of 3ds max and a new computer but most of the money will go to royalties to the other people involved or to buy things for my 16 year old twins, LOL.

You just have to work hard and perfect your skills and get your work out there for people to see. You will be very surprised. You also have to make movies that entertain and people will enjoy watching. So I want to encourage all of you to get your work out and make a go of it. You all are young and have a lot of ability and talent.

[kkffoo]

The commercial machinimators that I know tend to work very hard, and aren't earning a great deal, but enough to keep themselves going.
I think this is true of many people working in creative professions.

[lucindamc123]

The commercial machinimators that I know tend to work very hard, and aren't earning a great deal, but enough to keep themselves going.
I think this is true of many people working in creative professions.

Yes that is true of the artistic and creative professions at least in the US. But I don't want young people to give up trying or give up their dreams. And if this is something you really want you will find a way to do it. It is more difficult when you are young and you have to struggle to make it no matter what kind of job you have especially with today's economy.

[iceaxe]

Aww come on Lucinda. I'm all for encouraging people, but lets get real here.

For anyone planning to make a career out of machinima alone I would urge extreme caution. My point was that even though this is the case, it is perfectly possible to add simple animation prodution as a creative service, if you were already supplying creative services.

[andy_price]

I have just released my first commercial mods, and if I make enough to be able to buy the moviestorm lifetime package, I will be happy, but I am not going to hold my breath, or give up my day job

[lucindamc123]

I still don't want you to give up on your dreams or settle for anything less than what you want. . And I do understand that when you are young "life" gets in the way of your dreams. You know paying expenses, raising a family, putting food on the table. And it may not come fast but if you keep at it, you will get what you want.