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M.com poor comment moderation


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#1 kkffoo

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Posted 31 December 2010 - 03:02 PM

http://www.youtube.c...eature=youtu.be

If this page were a workplace, it would be possible to sue as the management have not made efforts to deal with abusive behaviour.

I've made a complaint on the m.com facebook wall
You may need to filter m.com's wall for 'others' to see it http://www.facebook....achinima?v=wall

I attempted to contact m.com via email and got an auto response 'so you want to be a machinima director?'

It's about time these guys* took some responsibility and I don't see why directors have to see this cr*p.

I say guys*, I mean I know** m.com it is actually one guy in a shed who has never made any money, but still.. there is absolutely no point in being menopausal if you don't capitalise on the ire at times.

**know as in deeply suspect.... I am not a lawyer

#2 luxaeternam

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Posted 31 December 2010 - 03:48 PM

Unbelievable. Is Mike aware of this?
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#3 kkffoo

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Posted 31 December 2010 - 04:25 PM

They make it very difficult to get in touch, no direct email.
I tweeted, posted on facebook wall, sent message on youtube.

Made me really angry, idiots will always gather wehn moderation is poor and these comments are abusive.

#4 MerryPaw

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Posted 31 December 2010 - 04:25 PM

QUOTE (luxaeternam @ Dec 31 2010, 03:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Unbelievable. Is Mike aware of this?


Ugg, how horrid some of the first comments were, what children. I enjoyed this story it had me looking behind me smile.gif
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#5 Chris Ollis

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Posted 31 December 2010 - 05:23 PM

It's the Internet, it's full of people who like bullying and swearing because they have no better way of expressing themselves and are more than likely reacting to their jealousy at what you have made or anger at not understanding something that others do.

It's often very hard to do, but you need to ignore it or laugh it off. Alternatively, if the idiot masses bother you, don't post in a public place.

Asking comments to be removed is censorship, granted the people who posted probably have no recollection of what they put as they have done a hundred similar posts since then - so wouldn't notice or mind, but if you start removing bad comments where do you stop? You'd have to delete half the internet at least laugh.gif

That's just my personal opinion, people post abusive comments on the animations I make, they've never met me so are not judging my character, if other people watch the animation and enjoy it then they will laugh at the idiot responses. If people agree then at least I've helped create a sense of community biggrin.gif
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#6 kkffoo

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Posted 31 December 2010 - 05:55 PM

No Chris, in another context allowing these comments to flourish would be illegal..employment law for instance.
The posters' behaviour is not acceptable, there are no excuses.

#7 Armanus

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Posted 31 December 2010 - 07:42 PM

The problem with citing law is enforcement on the internet. May be easy with interoffice emails or the like, but on the internet, you have problems with jurisdiction. Is the offender in that jurisdiction, is the site? Does the law apply at all? It's a tricky mess.

I think though, that just not posting in public is not the answer. Youtube account holders can remove or flag posts, and M.com should have some form of "policy" as to conduct from video responses to videos by other users featured on their page.

If it's any consolation, this treatment is reprehensible and speaks more of the people who said it then you, and if it were to stand it says something about M.com too, and I wouldn't allow them to show your videos on their site or the like if they aren't willing to take care of you.

I oppose censorship, and if it was simply saying dislike or a dissertation on how they felt the director lacked talent that would be one thing. This amounts to a verbal tossing of fecal matter at another's face.

#8 kkffoo

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Posted 31 December 2010 - 07:47 PM

This isn't my film by the way.
It looks like it is by a female director though.
The director would have no control to remove these remarks either, only M.com can do that.



#9 Chris Ollis

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Posted 31 December 2010 - 08:04 PM

QUOTE (kkffoo @ Dec 31 2010, 07:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
This isn't my film by the way.
It looks like it is by a female director though.
The director would have no control to remove these remarks either, only M.com can do that.


I'm confused now, and I thought mcornetto was a man (going by the bearded thumbnail!) biggrin.gif
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#10 kkffoo

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Posted 31 December 2010 - 08:12 PM

It doesn't really matter, the viewers (I use that term loosely) are responding as if the director is a woman due to the 'computer girl' splash screen on the movie.
Or so it appears.

#11 Killian

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Posted 31 December 2010 - 09:09 PM

Sadly, it's no surprise; unless you are utilising FPS or other game engines to create "machinima" (and M.com is well known for being derisive of anything that isn't "pure" machinima, as even a casual check of their forums will indicate), 95% of the comments are either abusive, highly negative or a combination of the two.

There are some discerning viewers and directors who reside within the depths of the M.com "community" (and I utilise the term loosely), but the majority seem to be limited to the "l33t speak/abusive/two brain cell" crowd, unfortunately (usually of the type along the lines of "WTF is this s@%t? Its not machinima/ what's this doing here?")

I know some people who won't touch M.com with a barge pole because of comments that have been directed at them or their work, including a few who used to upload their work via their director's program, but won't anymore due to the incredible negativity they face from that quarter; hardly conducive to promoting machinima as a field anyone who wants to be taken even semi-seriously using a 3d animation program wants to receive.

Of course, none of this excuses the language utilised by certain segments of those M.com content viewers.

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#12 Armanus

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Posted 31 December 2010 - 09:11 PM

Oh my mistake lol

I read the comments but didn't really look at the other details, do I drew and assumption, my bad.

Yeah, I understand Mcom is the only ones that can remove the comments since it's their channel. What I was saying is that they are capable of doing so. If it is a person showing their own clips and don't mind the comments that's their business, but if you are featuring someone else's work then I would think you are taking on some kind of obligation to ensure some civil behavior towards the director. And if they don't follow that thought, then it would be up to the individual directors or viewers to decide whether they want anything to do with that site or channel.

#13 rgr

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Posted 31 December 2010 - 09:23 PM

QUOTE (kkffoo @ Dec 31 2010, 03:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
http://www.youtube.c...eature=youtu.be

If this page were a workplace, it would be possible to sue as the management have not made efforts to deal with abusive behaviour.

I've made a complaint on the m.com facebook wall
You may need to filter m.com's wall for 'others' to see it http://www.facebook....achinima?v=wall

I attempted to contact m.com via email and got an auto response 'so you want to be a machinima director?'

It's about time these guys* took some responsibility and I don't see why directors have to see this cr*p.

I say guys*, I mean I know** m.com it is actually one guy in a shed who has never made any money, but still.. there is absolutely no point in being menopausal if you don't capitalise on the ire at times.

**know as in deeply suspect.... I am not a lawyer

I'm not following this. I'm looking at the youtube page for Michael's film and don't understand what you are angry about. I don't see anything called m.com either. I do see lots of the typical internet weenie nonsense that is everywhere, but not sure what part of that you are upset about. You seem to want a single moderator somewhere to step in and do something, but I don't know who you think that should be or what you think they should do.

Are you upset that people are leaving childish comments on this film's comment page? Can't the account holder disable that if he wishes? Who are you reporting this to? Do you mean youtube.com should moderate this? That doesn't seem reasonable.

Also, you gave a link to a "facebook wall" page, but I don't know what I'm supposed to find there. It looks like a bunch of machinima related comments (mostly about games, it seems).

I'm not trying to be difficult, I really just don't know exactly what you are upset about (I could imagine quite a few things, but nothing that really fits your description).

UPDATE: Ok, so I think I get it now. This is not Michael's youtube page, but machinima.com's youtube page? for Michael's film? And m.com is short hand for machinima.com? and you are not upset about the gratuitous machinima.com advertisements, but rather the childish comments random people are leaving?

I'm not sure if machinima.com gives filmmakers the option of allowing or disallowing comments on their movie pages or not, but either way, this is not nearly as bad as some of the comments I've seen on other pages (and other web sites).

I was under the impression you were offended at the machinima.com ad posing as a "video response" to the film, which it clearly isn't (it has nothing to do with the film). That's the thing that offends me a lot more than the silly comments from 13 year olds with youtube accounts. I don't use machinima.com and I don't get a lot of comments on my videos on youtube (nor do I get many views smile.gif ) so I guess I've never had to deal with this issue directly.

#14 lucindamc123

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Posted 31 December 2010 - 09:56 PM

You Tube isn't as good as it used to be ever since they started catering to ad agencies, movie studios, TV networks and such. As far as getting views on your films. as far as the comments on Mike's movie that was on Machimima.com's You Tube page, they were pretty awful but what more can you expect from 13 year old gamers. LOL. And not all of them are actually only 13 years old. I've got 16 year old twins so I know what it is like to deal with teenagers. They can be pretty mean. I take a lot of abuse at home. But you have to learn to get a thick skin and put on your blinders when you get really public in this business. It has been hard for me too since I have become better known. The comments I treasure are those from my friends, the people here at Moviestorm and those from the pros in the field who do like my work.

#15 Armanus

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Posted 01 January 2011 - 01:20 AM

QUOTE (lucindamc123 @ Dec 31 2010, 03:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You Tube isn't as good as it used to be ever since they started catering to ad agencies, movie studios, TV networks and such.


Translated: since they were purchased by google lol

You make good points Lucinda. Google is a good place to get your work seen, but it's never really been known for the comments people leave. However, I do believe that if you are showing someone else's work on your channel you have an obligation to that director. Maybe Mike isn't offended, I wouldn't be either because they're too ridiculous to pay any mind to, but I can see how someone might. Also when you consider the M.com is essentially a brand there should be consideration as to how this reflects on your brand. There should be some standards, even in a place with such low expectations as youtube.

#16 primaveranz

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Posted 01 January 2011 - 01:27 AM

QUOTE (lucindamc123 @ Jan 1 2011, 08:56 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
They can be pretty mean. I take a lot of abuse at home.


I can imagine what would have happened to me if I had abused my mum at that age. I probably wouldn't have made it to 17 (And quite right too!) laugh.gif

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#17 rgr

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Posted 01 January 2011 - 01:50 AM

QUOTE (Armanus @ Jan 1 2011, 01:20 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Translated: since they were purchased by google lol

I'm not sure what you mean here. Do you mean you think Google somehow made the comment section of youtube worse? Can you explain that? It doesn't make any sense to me. in fact, I don't see how youtube could do anything at all about this they don't already do (i.e. give you control over who can comment, and if you choose to let everybody comment, give you per comment controls).

If I get crank calls, I don't blame the phone company (or e.g. Verizon, if they buy the local phone company). Am I missing something?

#18 lucindamc123

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Posted 01 January 2011 - 02:45 AM

QUOTE (primaveranz @ Dec 31 2010, 07:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I can imagine what would have happened to me if I had abused my mum at that age. I probably wouldn't have made it to 17 (And quite right too!) laugh.gif


Well we do what we can with the kids. They are really hard to manage at that age, but my kids at least have really good moral standards, no drugs, partying, drinking. They are pretty nice kids but they do talk back a lot. Well my daughter bosses me around all the time. My son is pretty good but he won't do his work in school and if he would do it he would have all A's.


#19 lucindamc123

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Posted 01 January 2011 - 02:49 AM

On your own channel you can delete the comments but it is up to Machinima.com to delete the comments if the film maker requests it of them. I know you can report users to You Tube who are being abusive and they will do something about it too.

For some reason I do best right here on Moviestorm with my views of my movies. I am pretty sure the majority of the people who watch my films here are outside of Moviestorm but if you google my name and especially my ID lucindamc123 you will see a lot with Moviestorm come up with the videos and everything else. So that is I suppose how people find my movies here.

#20 Armanus

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Posted 01 January 2011 - 06:43 AM

@rgr, I was referring to the section of Lucinda's post that I quoted, about youtube catering getting ad-happy and catering to big media outlets. I don't hold them responsible for the quality or lack thereof of the comments on there.

I know M.com would be the ones that would have to do something with the comments. I'm making the case that they should do something.

I think most of us would get the best online reaction for our movies here or on other dedicated sites like TMU. It's natural, we're all related in our enthusiasm. Youtube is a totally different beast. if you want to understand that culture, watch "First" by Phil Rice. There is your YT reaction wink.gif


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