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#1 kv

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 02:34 PM

Why does modders workshop persistently fail to update machinestate when settings are changed?

This is pretty irritating to be honest.

I have two gestures that I need to sort out, one I mis-spelled the start state so it broke it`s closing option in moviestorm, tried to fix it in modshop and all seemed fine, saved and published, went in to moviestorm to find it had not done what I wanted, it was unchanged.

Then there is the second gesture which I accidentally created a wrong menu extension for it, so again went into modshop to fix, made the changes, saved and published. Loaded moviestorm and again, it had not changed it blink.gif

Why wont moviestorm update the machinestate?

Why do I have to go into the machinestate file and spend an age tracking down things that need fixing manually when I should be able to simply do it in modshop? dry.gif

#2 kkffoo

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 02:43 PM

It sounds like you have a case of modder's droop.

I don't have an answer to your question, just noting that it sounds similar to the situation when updating texture files...that MS holds on to the last know state and only adding a completely new texture file (or a renamed version) will force the workshop to notice a change.

#3 Chris Ollis

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 02:48 PM

QUOTE (kv @ Apr 18 2011, 02:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Why do I have to go into the machinestate file and spend an age tracking down things that need fixing manually when I should be able to simply do it in modshop? dry.gif


because that's what we have to do.

if its too much effort and you don't want it we can always get rid of the modders workshop? wink.gif
Also, if its too much effort, perhaps you understand how much blood, sweat and tears we've put in to get where we have biggrin.gif
Chris Ollis
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#4 kv

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 02:56 PM

QUOTE (Chris Ollis @ Apr 18 2011, 02:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
if its too much effort and you don't want it we can always get rid of the modders workshop? wink.gif


Er no thanks, no need tongue.gif

QUOTE (Chris Ollis @ Apr 18 2011, 02:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Also, if its too much effort, perhaps you understand how much blood, sweat and tears we've put in to get where we have biggrin.gif


I do appreciate the blood sweat and tears put in, but if modshop would cooperate on that one note then maybe you guys would go through less punishment when things go slightly pear shaped......and yes it would help us too wink.gif

#5 Ben_S

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 02:58 PM

QUOTE (kv @ Apr 18 2011, 02:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Why does modders workshop persistently fail to update machinestate when settings are changed?

This is pretty irritating to be honest.

I have two gestures that I need to sort out, one I mis-spelled the start state so it broke it`s closing option in moviestorm, tried to fix it in modshop and all seemed fine, saved and published, went in to moviestorm to find it had not done what I wanted, it was unchanged.

Then there is the second gesture which I accidentally created a wrong menu extension for it, so again went into modshop to fix, made the changes, saved and published. Loaded moviestorm and again, it had not changed it blink.gif

Why wont moviestorm update the machinestate?

Why do I have to go into the machinestate file and spend an age tracking down things that need fixing manually when I should be able to simply do it in modshop? dry.gif


The file is called 'StateMachine'. I wont get irritated if you call it Statemachine or statemachine or state machine, as long as you realise that isnt the actual filename.
Possible reasons for not saving correctly include:
When you selected the animation, it didnt change which addon you had selected correctly - it is possible to save a transition to multiple statemachines in different addons, which could cause problems if you have a rogue version in a different addon.
There are issues with saving gestures if you save the transition before you have made it into a gesture (on the menu tab). Make sure it is a gesture before you save it.

Modding requires being able to use a text editor. Sorry. While fixing these sort of bugs would be good, they dont seem to be very high priority.


Edit: A sugestion that might help the modding, if you are basically just modding your own stuff - Have a separate install that only has Base and Core installed, to do your modding. The modders workshop will load faster, and there are fewer addons for things to go wrong in. Also, once you have made your mod, you can publish and pack it, and you can try it on your full install, and see if it works.
You can stop a Moviestorm install from downloading all your addons by changing the autodownload=yes to autodownload=no in the boot/boot-win.properties (or mac, if you are using a mac).
Ben Sanders
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#6 kv

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 03:03 PM

Sorry, slur of the keyboard lol, always jumble the name up when I type it rolleyes.gif

Yeah I have gotten into the habit of making sure I set the animations as gestures before saving now after learning from previous mistakes, still does not make a difference though.

Anyway I shall battle on and chip away at the StateMachine file and fix it manually, then hope I don`t have fingers slip when setting up other stuff sleep.gif

Edit: Just spotted your edit after posting this, think that would be a good idea, speeding things up is always a good thing.

#7 kkffoo

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 03:52 PM

QUOTE (Chris Ollis @ Apr 18 2011, 02:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
because that's what we have to do.

If its too much effort and you don't want it we can always get rid of the modders workshop? wink.gif
Also, if its too much effort, perhaps you understand how much blood, sweat and tears we've put in to get where we have biggrin.gif


I'm not sure how helpful this is attitude wise, smilies or no smilies.

This program isn't aimed at 3d modelling professionals, so far as I can see most modders here are dedicated amateurs with day jobs who, if anything, have less time to deal with quirks than the stretched staff at Moviestorm.

The question that comes up often enough is 'why?'. Why is it this way rather than that?. Staff get an insight, even on the periphery, of why coding decisions are made. the ordinary user is left to guess and wonder and it adds to the frustration. It often isn't the work but the bewilderment which appears to cause the most distress.

#8 writerly

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Posted 19 April 2011 - 02:55 PM

QUOTE (kv @ Apr 18 2011, 02:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Why does modders workshop persistently fail to update machinestate when settings are changed?


When I have to update the statemachinestate I clobber the whole thing and start fresh. Otherwise it does those weird 'not updating' things. Same thing with verbs. Fresh start every time. It is tedious as hell, especially with a lot of actions, but it does work better in the end I have found.

My two cents.

C


#9 Chris Ollis

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Posted 19 April 2011 - 03:09 PM

QUOTE (kkffoo @ Apr 18 2011, 03:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The question that comes up often enough is 'why?'. Why is it this way rather than that?. Staff get an insight, even on the periphery, of why coding decisions are made. the ordinary user is left to guess and wonder and it adds to the frustration. It often isn't the work but the bewilderment which appears to cause the most distress.


There is no secret hidden meaning to it all Kate, what I'm saying is it's as broken for us as it is for you. As you say, we are a very stretched team and sometimes something that works with bugs is better than not having a modders workshop at all.

Sorry that we are causing bewilderment and stress, as Ben says "While fixing these sort of bugs would be good, they dont seem to be very high priority."
Chris Ollis
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Plus Minor Web Celebrity, Viral Guru, Advertising storyboarder, Toy designer, BBC and Channel4 comedy writer/animator :D

#10 kkffoo

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Posted 19 April 2011 - 07:07 PM

No, it's just frustrating not having the knowledge to guess solutions when problems arise.



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